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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">EJ,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">></span> it seems like focusing all your effort on having your workloads support using K8s primitives to drain nodes and have them safely respawn on another physical
host might be a better option<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">I can’t agree more. But our users/customers always want more when you give him/her an option. Who can blame their customers?
<span style="font-family:Wingdings">J</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">-Wei <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="ZH-CN" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"微软雅黑",sans-serif">发件人</span></b><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"微软雅黑",sans-serif">:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"微软雅黑",sans-serif"> EJ Campbell
[mailto:ejc3@oath.com] <br>
<b><span lang="ZH-CN">发送时间</span>:</b> 2018<span lang="ZH-CN">年</span>12<span lang="ZH-CN">月</span>18<span lang="ZH-CN">日</span> 15:33<br>
<b><span lang="ZH-CN">收件人</span>:</b> zhangwei (CR) <zhangwei555@huawei.com><br>
<b><span lang="ZH-CN">抄送</span>:</b> Ernst, Eric <eric.ernst@intel.com>; Stefan Hajnoczi <stefanha@redhat.com>; sweil@redhat.com; Qixuan Wu <qixuan.wu@linux.alibaba.com>; Graham Whaley <graham.whaley@gmail.com>; miklos@szeredi.hu; kata-dev@lists.katacontainers.io;
swhiteho@redhat.com; vgoyal@redhat.com<br>
<b><span lang="ZH-CN">主题</span>:</b> Re: [kata-dev] <span lang="ZH-CN">答复</span>: [Announce] virtio-fs released with Kata Containers support<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Hi Wei,<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Got it. Though given your workloads need to be able to survive a hardware failure anyway, it seems like focusing all your effort on having your workloads support using K8s primitives to drain nodes and have them safely respawn on another
physical host might be a better option.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Thanks for the quick response,<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">EJ<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Mon, Dec 17, 2018 at 11:28 PM zhangwei (CR) <<a href="mailto:zhangwei555@huawei.com">zhangwei555@huawei.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Hi EJ,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Kata Container is one tiny VM per POD, you can choose to run k8s+kata in another VM provisioned by
OpenStack, in this case, we run into the nested virtualization scenario. It works well but brings some unnecessary overhead from nested VM usage.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">To avoid this kind of overhead, we can also choose to run K8S cluster on bare metal, which means every
worker/node of K8S is bare metal machine instead of VM. By doing this, K8S becomes the lowest level of infrastructure and should provide live migration capability similar to OpenStack VM scenarios.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Live migration could be useful in this scene as every POD is a VM running on bare metal now, we need
a reliable way to keep workload alive when host machine needs reboot(let’s say, fixing some CVEs).</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">-Wei</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span lang="ZH-CN" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"微软雅黑",sans-serif">发件人</span></b><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"微软雅黑",sans-serif">:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"微软雅黑",sans-serif">
EJ Campbell [mailto:<a href="mailto:ejc3@oath.com" target="_blank">ejc3@oath.com</a>]
<br>
<b><span lang="ZH-CN">发送时间</span>:</b> 2018<span lang="ZH-CN">年</span>12<span lang="ZH-CN">月</span>18<span lang="ZH-CN">日</span> 14:11<br>
<b><span lang="ZH-CN">收件人</span>:</b> zhangwei (CR) <<a href="mailto:zhangwei555@huawei.com" target="_blank">zhangwei555@huawei.com</a>><br>
<b><span lang="ZH-CN">抄送</span>:</b> Ernst, Eric <<a href="mailto:eric.ernst@intel.com" target="_blank">eric.ernst@intel.com</a>>; Stefan Hajnoczi <<a href="mailto:stefanha@redhat.com" target="_blank">stefanha@redhat.com</a>>;
<a href="mailto:sweil@redhat.com" target="_blank">sweil@redhat.com</a>; Qixuan Wu <<a href="mailto:qixuan.wu@linux.alibaba.com" target="_blank">qixuan.wu@linux.alibaba.com</a>>; Graham Whaley <<a href="mailto:graham.whaley@gmail.com" target="_blank">graham.whaley@gmail.com</a>>;
<a href="mailto:miklos@szeredi.hu" target="_blank">miklos@szeredi.hu</a>; <a href="mailto:kata-dev@lists.katacontainers.io" target="_blank">
kata-dev@lists.katacontainers.io</a>; <a href="mailto:swhiteho@redhat.com" target="_blank">
swhiteho@redhat.com</a>; <a href="mailto:vgoyal@redhat.com" target="_blank">vgoyal@redhat.com</a><br>
<b><span lang="ZH-CN">主题</span>:</b> Re: [kata-dev] <span lang="ZH-CN">答复</span>: [Announce] virtio-fs released with Kata Containers support</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Hi Zhangwei,<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Could you go into more detail on the use case for live migration on bare metal?<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">EJ<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">On Mon, Dec 17, 2018 at 6:20 PM zhangwei (CR) <<a href="mailto:zhangwei555@huawei.com" target="_blank">zhangwei555@huawei.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Stefan, Eric,<br>
<br>
There isn't live migration requirement so far, but, I will take this as a potential requirement when Kata is growing more powerful.<br>
In my mind, this is rational as some of us are running kata on bare metal, in this scene, we don't have an infrastructure software such as OpenStack to guarantee the lifecycle of workload.<br>
<br>
Virtio-fs is in RFC state, it could be OK as long as it doesn't have native gap for supporting live migration, and I will be glad to see it being listed in some roadmap.<br>
<br>
By the way, really nice work! We finally get a better option against 9pfs :-) Thanks!<br>
<br>
-----<span lang="ZH-CN" style="font-family:宋体">邮件原件</span>-----<br>
<span lang="ZH-CN" style="font-family:宋体">发件人</span>: Ernst, Eric [mailto:<a href="mailto:eric.ernst@intel.com" target="_blank">eric.ernst@intel.com</a>]
<br>
<span lang="ZH-CN" style="font-family:宋体">发送时间</span>: 2018<span lang="ZH-CN" style="font-family:宋体">年</span>12<span lang="ZH-CN" style="font-family:宋体">月</span>17<span lang="ZH-CN" style="font-family:宋体">日</span> 22:30<br>
<span lang="ZH-CN" style="font-family:宋体">收件人</span>: Stefan Hajnoczi <<a href="mailto:stefanha@redhat.com" target="_blank">stefanha@redhat.com</a>><br>
<span lang="ZH-CN" style="font-family:宋体">抄送</span>: <a href="mailto:sweil@redhat.com" target="_blank">
sweil@redhat.com</a>; Qixuan Wu <<a href="mailto:qixuan.wu@linux.alibaba.com" target="_blank">qixuan.wu@linux.alibaba.com</a>>; Graham Whaley <<a href="mailto:graham.whaley@gmail.com" target="_blank">graham.whaley@gmail.com</a>>;
<a href="mailto:miklos@szeredi.hu" target="_blank">miklos@szeredi.hu</a>; <a href="mailto:kata-dev@lists.katacontainers.io" target="_blank">
kata-dev@lists.katacontainers.io</a>; <a href="mailto:swhiteho@redhat.com" target="_blank">
swhiteho@redhat.com</a>; <a href="mailto:vgoyal@redhat.com" target="_blank">vgoyal@redhat.com</a><br>
<span lang="ZH-CN" style="font-family:宋体">主题</span>: Re: [kata-dev] [Announce] virtio-fs released with Kata Containers support<br>
<br>
Stefan -<br>
<br>
No, there isn’t a live migration requirement for Kata (sorry for the top post). <br>
<br>
Eric<br>
<br>
> On Dec 17, 2018, at 6:27 AM, Stefan Hajnoczi <<a href="mailto:stefanha@redhat.com" target="_blank">stefanha@redhat.com</a>> wrote:<br>
> <br>
>> On Sun, Dec 16, 2018 at 09:09:48AM +0800, Qixuan Wu wrote:<br>
>> 1) Did you compare the performance to the virtio-blk raw or qcow2 <br>
>> solution of normal virtual machine?<br>
> <br>
> Not yet.<br>
> <br>
> Guest and host page cache performance can dominate benchmarks, so we <br>
> typically use fio direct=1 with QEMU -drive cache=none (O_DIRECT) to <br>
> focus purely on disk I/O performance and not page cache. The same <br>
> thing can be done with virtio-fs so that every I/O operation requires <br>
> communication with the host. In theory virtio-fs should be comparable <br>
> to virtio-blk on raw.<br>
> <br>
> In real-world scenarios the page cache will be enabled, especially for <br>
> the virtio-fs DAX feature. So I need to think carefully about what to <br>
> benchmark, but it will probably include both configurations.<br>
> <br>
>> 2) Whether does it impact live-migration of guest os ?<br>
> <br>
> Virtio-fs currently does not support live migration. Is there a <br>
> requirement for live migration with Kata Containers use cases?<br>
> <br>
> Stefan<br>
<br>
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